Lessons from the Vasa Shipwreck
21 points - last Wednesday at 10:07 PM
SourceThe FT article is an extremely superficial description of the events, which does a disservice to the depth and span of archaeological research and discovery which has taken place since the Vasa's discovery.
If anyone's visiting Stockholm, the Vasa museum is well worth a visit.
For those further afield, the museum's website offers a wealth of details about its conception, history, discovery, and our contemporary understanding of the wreck.
Vasa Museum: https://www.vasamuseet.se/en/explore/vasa-history/inquest
stanpinte
today at 2:04 PM
Agreed, not being a museum person at all I enjoyed a lot - also recommend fotografiska, insane collection!
Finnish technology students played an elaborate prank when the ship was being lifted. Just before the event, a group dived down to the ship and planted a statue of Paavo Nurmi, also known as "The Flying Finn", on the deck. When the ship was finally lifted, the legendary Finnish runner was one of the first things they discovered. This played well with the friendly rivalry between the neighbours, though the Swedes did not appreciate it as much.
https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasa-jäynä
SoftTalker
today at 5:02 PM
The story of the Vasa is one of my favorites for lessons in building software or anything complicated. Though I'm not sure how much of the story is actually true, it's still a good fable if nothing else.
"I'm not sure how much of the story is actually true"
The history and archaeology of the Vasa has been extensively studied by experts in their relevant fields – archaeology, history, dendrochronology, marine biology…
Some stories – like the one published here by FT – are overly simplistic. For a good, accurate, scientific history of the Vasa, the Vasa Museum's site is extremely detailed (and also separates supposition and apocryphal tales from established science).
Website of the Vasa Museum in Stockholm: https://www.vasamuseet.se/
SoftTalker
today at 5:27 PM
Yeah I didn't mean the truth is unknown, just that the popular version of the story (major design changes mandated late in the build by an executive who didn't understand the consequences of what they were asking for) might not be exactly true, depending on who is telling the story.
_doctor_love
today at 5:49 PM
The deeper issue was that no-one had the ability to push back on the king's demands. When the king rules by divine right, pushing back on the stakeholder is pushing back on God. Back in the day that was a great way to expedite the process of your head being separated from your torso.
I feel like people use this "remember the Vasa" idea every 6 months.
Yes, we all remember the Vasa, and understand how it applies to any untested overengineered idea.
_doctor_love
today at 5:50 PM
> Yes, we all remember the Vasa, and understand how it applies to any untested overengineered idea.
We clearly do not given that this story repeats over and over again.
It is an amazing museum. Highly encourage anyone passing through Stockholm to check it out.
bookofjoe
last Wednesday at 10:07 PM
https://archive.ph/cac8I
sillysaurusx
today at 5:36 PM
Are your comments no longer pinned at the top? I was surprised to see this so far down. It was what I needed.
What percentage of folks in this thread saw the Vasa because of “Intro Days”?
chiefgeek
today at 2:01 PM
I visited the museum two summers ago and it is really impressive. Even though I had caught some kind of cold and felt terrible, I thoroughly enjoyed my visit. Highly recommend.
lifestyleguru
today at 5:23 PM
The lesson was not to invade Poland and Lithuania but they didn't draw the conclusion.
_doctor_love
today at 5:51 PM
"I just want a deluge. Just one little deluge. Is that too much to ask?"
I find it ironic that the most prominent museum in Sweden is for a ship that only made it 3km before sinking.
While in Norway you can visit and walk aboard the "Fram". The most successful Arctic Exploration ship.
https://frammuseum.no/our-exhibitions/fram/
Hikikomori
today at 4:40 PM
Vasa is a fair bit older, are there any other as well preserved from its time?
There's not much older than the Vasa that is essentially intact. The Vasa is in good enough shape to have been recovered as a ship, and not as a shipwreck or an archaeological dig, which is pretty remarkable. I think there's one Ottoman galley a bit older that's been continuously maintained, and that's about it.
The reason it well preserved is the brackish water in Baltic Sea where the shipworm doesn't thrive.
I would say it is about 4 times older and 1000 times less successful. A factor of 250 in favor of Fram.